child with potential ptsd

[rebeccaxander]

Hi, I used to be on the yahoo group for phyc service dogs just for the training advice. We assumed that my 8 year old then 6 would potentially need a service dog since he was having such a horrible time with the nerves in his legs due to his chemotherapy (he is now in remission for Lymphoma) We left the list since he was doing better, and life just got in the way. No recently we realized that the behavioral issue we thought were caused by the horrible doses of steroids they gave the little guy (not so little anymore 110 lb 8 year old) but they didn't go away. Now we are walking through diagnosing his chemo caused problems. So far his intrethecal methotrexate (chemo injected into his spine) has caused several mild learning disabilities and somewhat mild ADHD. He was perscribed 18 mg of cencerta for the ADHD and that seems to be a big help in public. At home his siblings, and any other obstacle seems to trigger stress and frustration in him. Often this becomes violent. He Dr is concerned that he may have PTSD which is not that uncommon in children that have lived through chemo.

We are getting a phyc referral for him to a Dr that deals with kid issues and biofeedback. I'm not sure how those of you with PTSD use  your dog. I'm not sure at how I can incorporate Xander's dog that has spend most of the last 2 years out of the house (my husbands dog is hugely dog aggressive, but she is going to be the outdoor dog so Xander can have Hugo with him at all times). Xander has used my husbands dog to get through some pretty hard medical issues, but she is bonded to my husband and only tolerates Xander's needs. She loves him, buy you know what I mean. Its not the same. Now that I see we have much bigger issues then I thought we were going to have I'm not quite sure were to begin. I'm more then capable of training Hugo with whatever is needed (I've trained both dogs and horses before) but I need ideas on how to help Xander. I'm not even sure if Hugo will progress into a phyc service dog or a esa???? Not that both aren't a very valuable help.

[Kirsten]

The real question is what does you son need, not what others have done.  Each person and each service dog are individuals.  Just because people share the same diagnosis, doesn't mean they share the same task set.

So start at the beginning.  What is it that he can't do for himself that you are currently doing for him that a typical eight year old ought to be able to do for himself?  That's a rhetorical question, you should be asking and answering of yourself.  It's meant to help you look at this from the right direction.

Very few children actually need public access service dogs.  They have parents, and not all that much independence anyway due to their age and maturity.  Very many children who have been through trauma would benefit from a loving companion or emotional support animal.  Dogs will listen unjudgmentally and be unconditionally supportive.  A true best friend.  Frankly I think every kid would benefit from a healthy relationship with a pet, but some kids truly need that kind of relationship.

You'll need to take into account your child's anger issue.  He should not be left unsupervised with a dog, not only for the dog's safety, but for his own.

[bj2circeleb]

I agree totally with all the Kirsten has said. No two people with the same diagnoses are the same and you need to look at the individual needs of your son, and what it is that he cannot do for himself. In terms of a child with a service dog they need to be able to handle the dog 100% of the care, 100% of the time, and I really doubt if any 8 year old could do that. That does not mean that a dog cannot be trained to help a child at home, and be a great buddy for the child, and a huge emotional support. I just caution you against the idea of a public access service dog for such a young child especially if they are not capable of controlling and handling the dog 100% of the time.

Since you are still in the process of getting your son diagnosed, etc, I also feel that it is a bit premature to be thinking along these lines. Yes a dog will be a great friend for any child, especially those with all emotional needs, but in terms of tasks and problems the child has you really need to be trying a multitude of other things first.

Good Luck

[Roxie]

I don't see where a Service Dog would be of value to your son. Perhaps, you should consider an ESA, or just an all around good ol' family dog that is happy-go-lucky, patient, tolerant and likes kids, and maybe can do a few simple tricks your son can have him do. (catch, fetch, tug, beg, rollover, hide and seek, play dead, combat crawl... that kinda stuff.)

With your son's anger problems and the steroidal treatment with their problems... I'd be very watchful 100% of the time so the child and dog remain safe. I decompensate from steroid treatment, too.

Roxie

[rebeccaxander]

Thanks for the advice. I wasn't looking for a service dog at this point. It seems wildly unessesary. I'm hoping for people out there whos Post Traumatic Stress Dissorder or other life complication makes them have similar episodes as my son. I'm wondering if there are things that a ESA does for others that will give me ideas on helping my son. I seem to be the only one who can successfuly break through his berzerker like behaviour. One of his "issues" (yes this diagnosed by the neuro phycologist in charge of him) is that he gets locked in a thought cycle and can't break out the Phycologist was only looking at it from a education stand point. If he tackles a math problem and sees a potential solution then discovers thats the wrong solution he is unable to redirect his mind to find a different approach. Its the same in his non class work life. He will ask a question or attempt a behaviour. When he is unable to get the answer or do the behavior he phycologicaly cycles and is  unable to think of or do much of anything else. This gets him frustrated and he starts to cycle down anouther less plesant path. For some reason other family members don't seem to be able to see "oh yes Xander is starting to cycle, lets break him out of the cycle before he starts to melt down since he can't break the cycle himself" Its as simple as reminding him he is starting to cycle and needs to take a break from the problem. I work, and have teen daughters that need to watch him for me. Its so frustrating that they can't see that he is starting to cycle before it gets out of control. We were apt. managers at one point with many diabled tenants. Some of which had violent tendancys. Our boxer was usually in the office with us. If anyone including her owners raised their voices in anger she would growl. Everyone would calm themselves and life would be more peaceful. Now she would never had attached anyone, but the grown was a reminder to all of us. If Hugo could be taught to react to Xander's raised voice or better yet stress and go interact with him I think it might break the cycle. esspecialy if Xan knows that is what hugo doing and thinks?? I was hoping there might be other ideas or sugestions on how to go about doing this????

Rebecca

[Kirsten]

If a raised voice is a cue that he is cycling, then it can be used to teach your daughters to recognize the problem.

It is not safe for a dog to growl at any person.  Growling is an indication he feels he has the right to control the behavior of that person.  Allowing it gives him permission to bit the person should he (the dog) deem it appropriate.  It is fortunate that you Boxer did not bite, but a very real risk that he might at any time, even if he hadn't done so previously.  There's always the first one.

If your child has anger issues, those really need to be resolved before he is partnered with a dog or any other animal.  If he were to turn his anger on to the animal, the animal might turn on him in self-defense.

I have PTSD (Post Traumatic Stress Disorder).  What you've described is not typical of PTSD as I know it.  Getting stuck sounds like more of an OCD issue to me (though I am not a doctor).  In either case, ultimately psychotherapy to teach him how to recognize when he is getting in to such a state and how to break himself out of it will probably be the most helpful solution for him, giving him the greatest possible independence.  It is effective for most people, so I'd start with that, then consider other options.

[ronco3765]

Rebecca, I'm wondering if your son has had a Cat Scan and an MRI. If not, maybe your doc should be looking into that. There was so much that was familiar in your post that this is what makes me ask this. You might be surprised to find that what is being termed PTSD is really something that needs to be addressed as physical issues, caused by the chemo. Right now I would advise against a dog, for both parties involved, If it is something physical it should be taken cars of before considering it hopeless. The cycling part was interesting - you might want to start keeping a diary of the instances and circumstances that this happens.

[bj2circeleb]

I also have PTSD and what you are describing does not sound anything like PTSD. I also agree with Kirsten that dogs do not growl for no reason, and it is always a precurser to them saying I do not feel comfortable with this and I will bite if I need to. I also agree with Ronco, that I would want a full physical, including MRI, etc to rule out any underlying brain abnormality.

[Cera]

As someone with a 'medically fragile' brother who spent a good portion of his childhood in the hospital in a life-threatening situation, I think I understand the symptopms of PTSD that you mean.  His PTSD is very different than mine that came about for very different reasons.  With my brother, his issues seemed to stem from the fact that he didn't get to create his own autonomy--he had so many people caring for him and he was so sick that he never got to make his own decisions, take risks (like walk outside without a mask), or be a normal boy.  So he missed develpmental milestones, couldn't relate to people and started creating triggers.  Mostly his response to a trigger was anger.  He never knew boundaries (from his body was constantly being invaded to it being ok to have ice cream for every meal), never knew how to take responsibility for himself (he had to rely on adults for everything).  So thats the type of thing that caused him to trigger and to lash out.  So I think I get you when you talk about the cycling.

In theory I think a dog in that situation can be used as a motivator, something to teach responsibility and especially a non-judgemental friend.  As tasks go, I'd be more inclined to work with biofeedback and behavioral therapy.  Working with him now to really tackle these problems should help him succeed when he's older and needs to truly be independant.

I am not a doctor.  There are great psychiatrists who specialise in working with children who have experienced life-threatening illnesses.  From the sounds of it, I think that they will be the best guides.